Richard Gizbert talks to Alex Miller, Milène Larsson and Aris Roussinos of VICE News

The disruptive and unconventional news model of VICE News was a fitting topic for the night that the Frontline Club unveiled their slightly longer, disruptive and exciting ‘Showcase’ evening on Wednesday 30 April.

In a mixture of debate, film and discussion, the audience were treated to two different segments on the ‘changing news landscape’ and the advent of VICE’s new news channel.

Richard Gizbert, presenter of Al Jazeera English’s The Listening Post, chaired the evening that started by sitting down with Alex Miller, Milène Larsson and Aris Roussinos from VICE, to discuss how they are changing the way news is delivered and to show some clips of their online documentaries.

Gizbert asked the team why VICE is different and how is it proving so successful, Miller, VICE’s editor in chief replied:

“When we started people said that online video had to be cats pissing around in baths. We did the exact opposite and made long-form documentaries. The interesting thing is that it was the serious stuff that was getting the most passionate support. We’ve been nudged towards it by watching the things our viewers are interested in.”

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As a journalist who freelanced for the BBC and Channel 4 before he became a reporter at VICE News, Roussinos commented that “one thing that makes me pretty happy working at VICE is that I’ve got pretty much absolute editorial freedom. Because we can have a longer format on the internet, we are not hemmed in by runtimes. There is a thirst for knowledge – why not feed it?”

“There is a little bit of a myth or a hype going on. [These documentaries] are something Reuters could have done, or Unreported World – I can’t see you’re doing anything different. Is it really the case that people come to your site because they have lost faith in the mainstream media?” filmmaker Sean Langan pointed out from the audience.  There was also concern from the audience that the documentaries lacked context, in particular geo-political context.

After a brief hiatus of drinks in the members’ clubroom courtesy of Chivas Brothers, the second part of the evening got underway.

Richard Sambrook, professor of journalism and director at the Centre for Journalism; Kevin Sutcliffe, VICE head of news production for Europe; Richard James, news editor of BuzzFeed UK; and Tom Giles, editor of the BBC’s Panorama, joined Gizbert to discuss the broader subject of the changing media landscape.

Giles pointed out that the BBC will probably be looking to places like VICE for tips going forward, especially with BBC Three being taken off air: “BBC Three will still go on online, and I’m not an expert, but can’t imagine they won’t turn to people like VICE and want to know how they can inform the whole online younger audience landscape.”

Sambrook raised the concern that VICE and other online outlets have not had any crises yet, and a test will be how they can survive them.

Sutcliffe, who had previously been Channel 4’s Dispatches editor pointed out that:

“It’s all virgin territory to us, we are just finding our way – we’re not trying to reinvent the wheel, we’re doing good content we are spending money on that content. We think it’s an opportunity to try and grow a network that works, one that doesn’t have to take its model from legacy media – it doesn’t have to be invested in.”

Gizbert asked James what it is like to come from a print background (as a journalist at Metro and The Daily Mail) to a solely online medium. “It is fantastic. There is so much more freedom and creativity not having to chase the daily news agenda,” he replied.

“In a terrible way, we are prisoners of our form,” said Giles, talking about legacy media. “The reason [online only] is liberating is because you don’t need to worry about how is it going to fit on the channel, or how is it going to get marketed at 8:30pm on BBC One. By the time we’ve got the money and the commission, you’ve already put it out there in a new form in a new landscape”

“But at what moment when other people pop up to do the same thing, and when the competition starts, and it really starts to crunch,” he added.

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“That four thousand word report from the Syrian refugee camp…will not be read as much as ‘10 cats that have got thoughts about Syria’,” New Statesman‘s Deputy Editor Helen Lewis said in her opening statement on the second panel of the Grapevine event at the Frontline Club on Thursday 23 January.

Read highlights of the first panel discussion here.

Merope Mills, Luke Lewis and Pete Picton

The chair head of journalism at City University, George Brock, got straight to the point and asked the panel ‘is traditional media actually dying and does it matter?’

Deputy publisher of Mail Online Pete Picton said categorically:

“If journalism is what we’re talking about then no absolutely not, in fact it’s thriving.”

Editor of Buzzfeed UK Luke Lewis:

“It’s an amazing time for journalism, not just for new outlets like Buzzfeed, the traditional ones are thriving. It was only a week or two ago that The Telegraph posted their figures of a £60million profit last year. The Guardian has had their best scoops in their history.

“Media is a really big place and we don’t need anyone else to fail in order to Buzzfeed to succeed.”

All the panelists agreed that, while media isn’t dead, the business model has to change.

http://twitter.com/rebeccacmyers/status/426478712826368002

Editor of the Saturday Guardian Merope Mills:

“The way people approach print media has to change…the traditional media money making model is dead.”

"There is still an appetite for print journalism, but the business model has to change." Merope Mills, @guardian #fbj

— Sarah Biddlecombe (@_sarahstweets) January 23, 2014

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H Lewis said that there is a real problem with public interest journalism:

“Who is going to be in an online only economy commissioning that four thousand word report from the Syrian refugee camp – I just don’t see that that’s a viable business model for anybody because it won’t be read by enough people. It will not be read as much as ’10 cats that have got thoughts about Syria’ – no offence to Buzzfeed.”

Buzzfeed taking a hit for cats – good retort from luke lewis #fbj

— Tom Witherow (@TomWitherow) January 23, 2014

L Lewis:

“Yes most of it is entertaining lists, you’ll also see some other stuff in there… Max Seddon we’ve got on the ground in Kiev at the moment, he wrote a series of explosive reports on what’s happening in Kiev as good as impact reporting you’ll see anywhere.”

@lukelewis says that he wants Buzzfeed to eventually supply as trusted news as the @nytimes #fbj

— Max Benwell (@Max_Benwell) January 23, 2014

Mills noted the changes she’d recognised in print media:

“There is a theme among the [print publications] that are growing and they do tend to be those longer analytical – the New Statesman is one… Nobody wants to read breaking news anyone, we all know the Victoria Line’s flooded with cement and that will be old by tomorrow.”

Mills echoed the comment made by Mona Chabali in the first panel of the evening:

“All the reporters have to be reporting a more in depth piece, the why’s of the ‘gays in Russia’ rather than the just ‘gays are being beaten up’. That is the piece you want to read at the end of the week.”

In reference to another signifying characteristic of Buzzfeed the idea of a move away from display to native advertising.

L Lewis:

“It’s nothing new, people talk about sponsored posts like it’s a new thing…[in magazines] advertorials have been around for decades. The only thing you have to worry about is that there’s a clear dividing line between what is editorial and what is commercial.”

A question from the audience asked, if you don’t charge for it how can you put a value on it?

Picton said:

“You value it in time. It’s far more competitive to get our readers to read us… time is a big currency now…that’s one of the key metrics for us now, to keep them on the site.”

Time spent engaging with online content is the new form or readers' currency. #fbj

— Hari Sethi (@Hari_Sethi) January 23, 2014

Another audience member asked the panels opinion on maintaining journalistic integrity in the battle for getting as many clicks as possible in light of the recent CNN headline which seemed to go a step too far.

@MartinBelam @jburnmurdoch @alexparsons CNN had a go & got it fairly wrong today #fbj: pic.twitter.com/uwukxg3UrE

— dan barker (@danbarker) January 23, 2014

The panel agreed that the headline missed the mark on the sensitive issue, L Lewis said about the wider topic of click bait:

“You keep hearing this word clickbait and it really annoys me because it suggests there’s another kind of headline you don’t want people to click on. I don’t know who these journalists are who are writing articles that they don’t want people to read.”

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H Lewis added:

“Isn’t it sad that the art of the pun is now dead? I loved a good/bad pun.”

To which L Lewis replied:

“I think the pun’s had a good 200 years.”

Following the success of their events, Grapevine are launching a data-focused site in the coming months. Get in touch with Harry Lambert (@harrylambert1), Max Benwell (@maxbenwellreal) or Rebecca Choong Wilkins at contact@grapevinevents.co.uk.

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